Basho Talk - Hatsu Basho 2017 ** (SPOILERS)

[robnplunder 949]

In any case, this isn't called consistently, is it?   It seems like most matches are decided by who touched down first regardless.  

[Tsuchinoninjin 1,064]

Rocks, the picture you posted certainly looks like he is pulling Ura forward on the mawashi and not 'driving' him into the ground.

[Rocks 1,750]

2 minutes ago, Tsuchinoninjin said:

Rocks, the picture you posted certainly looks like he is pulling Ura forward on the mawashi and not 'driving' him into the ground.

The 2nd picture, yes. That is just a moment after the 1st. In the 1st his right hand is pushing down on his mid back as he starts to leap. In the 2nd he is a few inches off the ground and his right hand shifts to start to push at the shoulder. He's pulling and pushing at the same time. Without Yama actions Ura probably follows Yama straight out instead of going to ground and sliding out as Ura did. 

These are always tough calls. They can go either way. for me the deciding factor is who is active, aggressive. In this case both are, unlike Ishiura/Daishomaru where ishiura is clearly having no effect. Where both are active it should come down to who touched down first which Ura clearly does here.

That's my opinion anyway.

 

 

[Asashosakari 16,989]

Kintamayama's daily digest has two reverse angle slo-mos which make it much more clear that Yamaguchi had little (if any) contact anymore as he was blasted out.

[Bumpkin 438]

The problem, as I see it, is that the dohyo is raised off the ground. Which means the person who touched down first isn't always the loser if their opponent is flying out of the dohyo. Which means that a hard and fast who-touched-down-first rule doesn't always work. Which means it's subjective. The good news is that there are five judges sitting ringside. They get it right almost all the time.

[robnplunder 949]

1 hour ago, Bumpkin said:

The problem, as I see it, is that the dohyo is raised off the ground. Which means the person who touched down first isn't always the loser if their opponent is flying out of the dohyo. Which means that a hard and fast who-touched-down-first rule doesn't always work. Which means it's subjective. The good news is that there are five judges sitting ringside. They get it right almost all the time.

Agreed.

An observation though - typically, a monoii will be called on something like what happened with Ura on day 11.  There were other matches Ura won which I thought monoii had to be called.  But they never came.   Ura did lose on a monoii/restart on one match where the shimpan pointed to Ura for a win.  Even that, I thought Ura initially lost and didn't deserve a restart.    To me, a few more calls (or no calls) went to Ura's way in this basho.  Good for him.  But, in the end, I believe things will average out.   

Edited January 19, 2017 by robnplunder

[Rocks 1,750]

Heh, Amakaze blew Asahisho out of the ring  but a matta was called. So they did it again and Amakaze did the exact same thing.

[Rocks 1,750]

2 henkas in Juryo already. The desperation is showing. 

Can someone drop from j5 to makushita? because Kitataiki deserves it after this basho.

Edited January 19, 2017 by Rocks

[robnplunder 949]

Ok, Ura beat ailing/aging Aminishiki cleanly.   No monoii was needed.   I fell sorry for Aminishiki.   I hope he saved enough money to retire .  Ura, OTOH, is looking like he will start the next basho in Makuuchi.   I don't have high hopes in his debut.   He's likely go kachi-koshi  (5-10, 6-9?).

Edited January 19, 2017 by robnplunder

[Rocks 1,750]

Aminishiki has a kabu. he'll be fine.

[Rocks 1,750]

Man that Hokutofuji has a heck of a tachi-ai. But did you see that look on Ichinojo's face? He was like "I remember what you did to me in November. Not again you SOB". I knew Ichinojo would win.

[Jojo 11]

6 hours ago, Akaoni said:

Long time lurker, first time poster.  I found this quite confusing that Ura won this bout.  Is the thinking that because he was the aggressor that he gets the win even though he touched first?  Clarification of the finer points of this ruling would be appreciated.  TIA!

Here you go....

Ooops the link in the thread is dead (should've known not to trust Kintamayama :-D), here is a working one....

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20151018075149/http://the-japan-news.com/news/article/0002157910

 

 

Edited January 19, 2017 by Jojo
working link

[Jakusotsu 5,006]

Already looking forward to Kintamayama's audience with Takekaze.

[Rocks 1,750]

That wasn't much of an effort from Goeido, was it?

[Rocks 1,750]

I love Ikioi, and he gave it one hell of an effort but he can't go to the belt and you can't beat kise without going to the belt. Way to go Kise.

[Rocks 1,750]

Poor Giku. I'll be rooting for you in March buddy.

[robnplunder 949]

Kise almost lost again.  In the last 3 or so matches, Kise wasn't very impressive IMO.  

Could Takanoiwa or Ichinojo surprise Kise, and even take the yusho cup?   I hope not but both of them look solid so far.  

Mitakeumi at M1w with 9-3 record already may end up being M1e in the next basho regardless of what he does in the next 3 matches.  Bummer.

 

 

[Rocks 1,750]

Takanoiwa is great this basho but I don't give him much of a shot against Takyasu tomorrow which is why I think they put him against him. Ichinojo will not have an easy time against Chiyoshoma either. But I think Ichi will win. We'll see who Ichi gets on day 14. I wouldn't be surprised if it's Mitakeumi.

[serge_gva 52]

15 hours ago, Benihana said:

Kisenosato not showing yusho-esque sumo? You sure you're watching Hatsu 2017 on Kintamayama's channel, not Hatsu 2016? That was un-yusho-esque sumo.

His bouts were much more convincing in other tournaments, but that is just my feeling. It lacks the serenity they often have.

[Kuroyama 715]

1 minute ago, serge_gva said:

His bouts were much more convincing in other tournaments, but that is just my feeling. It lacks the serenity they often have.

That's because he's not serene. He's feeling the pressure, and is narrowly avoiding choking.

[Benihana 1,751]

But to win those fights you have to have skills and Kisenosato has those skills. Others would have lost today. I hope he finally gets his first yusho to get rid all that pressure, would do him good.

[WAKATAKE 2,382]

Geek will become the first ozeki since former stablemate Kotooshu to fall from the ozeki ranks, and 16th overall since the kadoban system has been in place.

[Gernobono 399]

2 hours ago, Rocks said:

Poor Giku. I'll be rooting for you in March buddy.

you might be rooting for hidenoyama oyakata

[Huschnu 5]

Strong grimace game by Ikioi today 

[Morty 1,426]

3 hours ago, serge_gva said:

His bouts were much more convincing in other tournaments, but that is just my feeling. It lacks the serenity they often have.

I'm not sure I agree. Yes he has taken his time but he has generally not looked like he is going to lose them. Normally he would have lost one if not two of those bouts. Three to go...