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Akinomaki

Sumo related new subforums

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The placement of this and other clearly sumo-related things in "Off-Topic" highlight a need for a "General Sumo" forum that isn't specifically Ozumo or Ama-Sumo related.

Agreed, and moved to Ozumo Discussions. Admin has suggested some reorganization of the sub-forums. Those who have some constructive input are encouraged to use the public feedback sub-forum to offer their suggestions.

I once again am annoyed that we have no proper sub-forum for sumo-related off-topics - Japan-Japanese discussions is slightly better than Off-Topic, but both are not where news regarding former rikishi or many things inspired by sumo belong - together with all the things completely unrelated to sumo.

I think a new "General Sumo" sub-forum as the first in "SUMO RELATED SUBJECTS" would be enough.

with

"Discuss here about things related to or inspired by sumo, that are not just about actual ozumo or amateur sumo itself."

Many topics from all other sub-forums at request could be moved to such a sub-forum.

The Japan-Japanese sub-forum should be then used only for things regarding Japan other than sumo and Off-Topic only for really sumo unrelated topics.

That still leaves the problem that things unrelated can be compared with sumo or a sumo connection can be found later - and the topic might have to be moved to the general sub-forum.

Edited by Akinomaki

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I think a new "General Sumo" sub-forum as the first in "SUMO RELATED SUBJECTS" would be enough.

with

"Discuss here about things related to or inspired by sumo, that are not just about actual ozumo or amateur sumo itself."

Many topics from all other sub-forums at request could be moved to such a sub-forum.

I broadly agree, but I'm not sure if "General Sumo" is a good idea for its name (even with an explanatory note) - I suspect that's going to result in a lot of new and irregular posters putting stuff in there that really ought to go to Ozumo Discussions. In all other forums I've seen that had a "general X" section, that was a catch-all section hierarchically placed above the more specialized areas, while we're rather looking to create an "off-topic from Ozumo" subsection.

At the risk of suggesting a Department of Redundancy Department solution, maybe simply "Sumo-related Discussions" would work.

While we're at it, should the Japan-Japanese section be moved to the non-sumo categories afterwards? It's not like anyone ever uses it for the only sumo-related purpose that would then remain, talking about sumo in Japanese.

Edited by Asashosakari

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Going a bit further on the reorganization scheme - the two Sumo Information Pond areas really aren't working out all that well.

Featured Rikishi/Heya is pretty much dead, and I'm not sure it deserves a perpetual main page spot. I'd rather just see all those threads dumped into Ozumo Discussions, with perhaps a table of contents-type thread created to make them easy-ish to find again.

And Sumo Information desperately needs a new name, if not outright scrapping as well - how often have we had newbies who thought it's a place to ask for sumo information and were confused they couldn't start new topics in it? ;-) I still do believe we need some sort of system for highlighting especially useful threads, but the way the section has developed is a bit of a mess, IMHO, especially as several of the threads really didn't prove to have the type of longevity one would expect of an information repository (e.g. all the blog threads).

I suspect everything in there could be moved to other areas once a general/sumo-related section has been created. Perhaps a FAQ-style sticky at the top of Ozumo Discussions would be more useful for organizing an overview of especially useful threads...

Edited by Asashosakari

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How about "Opinion/ Commentary". Obviously all the posts following the main one in the ozumo and honbasho sub-forums are mostly opinion but the posts themselves are usually facts and happenings. This one would be for stuff like this, which is mainly commentary/ opinion from start to finish.

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Indeed, there has been discussion regarding the reorganization of some of the subforums. My current draft is as follows:

General Information

  • Forum Announcements
  • Help and Public Feedback

Sumo Discussion

  • Ozumo Discussions
  • Honbasho Talk
  • Amasumo Discussions

Sumo-Related Subjects

  • Sumo Media (image dumps, videos, blogs, etc.)
  • Other-things-loosely-connected-to-sumo ("Sumo Off-topic")
  • Sumo Games

Non-Sumo Related

  • Member Introductions
  • Off-Topic
  • Test Forum

Out of the current subforums, Sumo Information would be dismantled and its contents split between Discussions and Media, and Polls and Japan-Japanese Discussions would be integrated into Sumo Off-topic. Another suggestion was to replace Ozumo Discussions and Honbasho Talk with Current Events and General Discussion.

Comments welcome.

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Another suggestion was to replace Ozumo Discussions and Honbasho Talk with Current Events and General Discussion.

Not a fan of that idea. For obvious reasons the numerous threads currently being posted in Honbasho Talk tend to have a very short shelf-life, while a lot of the threads in Ozumo Discussions are exactly the opposite, running for months and even years. I'd hate to see those getting buried by 100 or so new (and in the long run rather inconsequential) threads every time a basho happens to roll along.

Unless, I suppose, the number of new threads getting created during a basho was to be massively streamlined, i.e. daily pics posts offloaded to the new media section, leaderboards condensed into two threads rather than 20, etc. But I think that would be rather a step too far, compared to just keeping the two "big" sections the way they are.

Also, are there still folks who like the fact that threads in Ozumo Discussions are being kept (more or less) spoiler-free during a basho? Doesn't affect me, but that seemed to be a consideration for some in the past.

---

The full proposed outline makes sense to me, although I'm tempted to suggest keeping the polls forum as a separate area, and I'd argue it should join Amasumo on the way up into the Sumo Discussion block. (Perhaps the polls would also get a bit more traffic up there.) If the polls section is getting scrapped, moving the polls into Sumo-Off-Topic strikes me as a bit of a weird choice; those threads are clear Ozumo Discussions material, IMHO.

Edited by Asashosakari
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I very much dislike the "Sumo Media" part. Most of the media are recent information, most posts are information plus media and many are part of or lead to discussion.
I'd rather have that continue under the name "Sumo information pond" as then one sub-forum under sumo related discussions, with the ability to post new topics.
The daily basho pics, in memorials etc. could be posted there, but as "Sumo Media" even the daily basho video thread would have to move there.

Edited by Akinomaki

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My draft proposal

General Information

  • Forum Announcements
  • Help and Public Feedback

Sumo Discussion

  • Ozumo Discussions
  • Honbasho Talk
  • Amasumo Discussions
  • Sumo Information pond
  • Sumo Polls
  • Sumo Off-Topic (about persons and things related to sumo, but not in it - anymore)

Because there will still be many topics that can be in several of the above sub-forums, they should at least be all together in one department. Polls are a special format and should be separate, but it's definitely a form of sumo discussion - other polls could be in the real "Off-Topic".

Sumo Games

Other Subjects

  • Member Introductions
  • Japan-Japanese discussions
  • Off-Topic

Test Forum

Japan-Japanese discussions about things not related to sumo: understanding the Japanese language and Japanese culture is helpful to understand sumo, so I would have that separate.
Member Introductions are related to sumo as well, on this forum anything can be sumo related.
Sumo games are a special category that should it be on its own, as could be the Test Forum.

Edited by Akinomaki

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I quite like Akinomaki's proposal.

would things like Sumo documentary videos or Endo's new CM fall under "Sumo Off-Topic" then?

What is the Topic exactly?

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Endo or other active rikishi or oyakata in a CM for me is Ozumo discussions, a collection of it is for the Information Pond.
Sumo Off-topic I would use for CMs with (fake) sumo appearance, all info about former rikishi, Sumo Art/Music/Merchandise/Anime/Customs and sumo appearing in Japanese culture other than amateur sumo competitions.
Also for the recent Meet and Greet topic, but I would prefer to have the Member introductions be expanded to include member activities like this.

Anything looking like sumo related in Japan-Japanese discussions and Off-topic should be moved to Sumo Off-topic.

Sumo documentary videos I would move to the Sumo Information Pond, like all special picture galleries that are separate from the news. I would keep in the pond all that is presently there and move the featured rikishi topics all to Ozumo discussions.

Present topics in Sumo Discussion should only be moved to the pond or Off-topic if still in use.

Many things will not be that easy to classify.

Edited by Akinomaki

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Not sure about other people but when I visit I just click "mark as read" for the games forum and then "view new content". The subforums are more or less bypassed that way.

Sure, it's a problem people have when actually creating a new thread. Also, they are useful when searching for past stuff. Sure, for reading the newest posts you don't need subforums too much (although even your example badly needs the Games subforum).

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Endo or other active rikishi or oyakata in a CM for me is Ozumo discussions, a collection of it is for the Information Pond.

Sumo Off-topic I would use for CMs with (fake) sumo appearance, all info about former rikishi, Sumo Art/Music/Merchandise/Anime/Customs and sumo appearing in Japanese culture other than amateur sumo competitions.

Also for the recent Meet and Greet topic, but I would prefer to have the Member introductions be expanded to include member activities like this.

Anything looking like sumo related in Japan-Japanese discussions and Off-topic should be moved to Sumo Off-topic.

Sumo documentary videos I would move to the Sumo Information Pond, like all special picture galleries that are separate from the news. I would keep in the pond all that is presently there and move the featured rikishi topics all to Ozumo discussions.

Present topics in Sumo Discussion should only be moved to the pond or Off-topic if still in use,.

Many things will not be that easy to classify.

I agree with most of your points.

This reorganisation would be a major job though. And how far nack in time would reclassification have to go not to confound any searches?

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