Hakuho, 27 Yusho and Counting

[Shiro 13]

So he's tied Asa. And he's only 28 years Old. I think Hakuho has the chance to become the all time Yusho leader and more. He's arguably the greatest Yokozuna of all time. If he achieves that and tallies up over 1,000 wins I think he will be. As much as I love Harumafuji I think Yokozuna was maybe not the greatest thing for him. He was a great Ozeki. Now he's a mediocre Yokozuna and that fact may shorten his career. If Kaio had made it to Yokozuna he never would hung around as long as he did.

[Kaioshoryu 63]

If you believe the conspiracy theorists, he won't be allowed to become alltime yusho leader since he's not japanese...

[Afrozuna 8]

Its way too early to call HFJ a mediocre Yokozuna especially seeing as he has already won a yusho at that level, he is definately not Wakanohana. I dont think anyone expected a string of zensho yushos from HFJ considering his size and his AGE and the technique and skill of his main rival. This is the same Hakuho who stood toe to toe with Asashoryu whom many (myself included) swore would be the gretest ever. I for one never thought Hakuho would reach 25 yusho. I expected Asashoryu to keep racking them up but alas the elbow injury happened and fate has favoured Hakuho.

Records are made to be broken and I would like to see the 32 yusho record fall in my lifetime. However at 28 one has to acknowledge it will require a major effort and lots of luck. Injuries are the main threat. Remember also many were writing Hakuho's obituary around this time last year despite pleas telling them to "sit down".

[aderechelsea 124]

Harumafuji is nowhere near a mediocre yokozuna. He shouldn't be going intai for many years to come.

[Shiro 13]

Honestly I should really retract that Harumafuji statement. He's my favorite rikishi of all time. I just have this fear that because of injuries etc that he won't be remembered as the great wrestler and Yokozuna I know he is. Consistency is something he seems to have trouble with. And I'm sure that's just injuries nagging at him.

[aderechelsea 124]

personally i still rate Wakanohana as one of the best i have ever watched. I don't care if he was an unsuccessful yokozuna (not the case with HMF) ... he is still great.

if the same happens with Harumafuji (which i doubt) everyone can remember his 2 zensho as Ozeki and 1 as Yok. Really ... intai should be a long way from now.

[Asashosakari 19,112]

And he's only 28 years Old.

That's pretty old actually for someone like him who came up so young...he's been fighting at the highest-possible level for over 8 years now. Many top rikishi have hit the wall around 10 years, often quite abruptly.

[Igordemorais 75]

So boring. Im done with sumo.

[Treblemaker 254]

Hak does have a chance to be the Greatest, and I feel lucky that I happened onto sumo in time to see Asa, Hak and HF at their best. And barring something catastrophic, Hakuho will end up on top, regardless of conspiracies or otherwise. Can't see how the Kyokai can prevent it if it comes to that.

Also don't see a Native Yok anytime within the next 2-3 years, if longer.

In fact, can see a scenario ca. 2016/17 where both HF and Hak have retired due to falling numbers, and there's no one to fill the Yokozuna position.

[wimcowie 0]

In fact, can see a scenario ca. 2016/17 where both HF and Hak have retired due to falling numbers, and there's no one to fill the Yokozuna position.

You don't think Kisenosato, after this week's performance, has a shot to fill the position?

[Benevolance 2,484]

When my wife and I visited Japan the first time and went to sumo, Hakuho had just been promoted to yokozuna. I have to admit, I became a fan of Hakuho because the Hakuho bento lunch at the kokugikan was better that the Asashoryuo bento, and because we liked Western japan more than eastern japan, so we cheered for all the 'western' wrestlers loudly. We didn't know that the east/west division was rank based, rather than location based.

We're still Hakuho fans, because he's the best sumo wrestler in forever. But we both liked the Hakuho that patted his opponents and helped them up, more than the Hakuho that gives the extra shoves at the end of matches.

[Tsubame 359]

Also don't see a Native Yok anytime within the next 2-3 years, if longer.

Does anyone forseen that Harumafuji will became a yokozuna 1,5 or 2 years ago? I guess noone... So you can never say that there will be such a long period till the next yokozuna. Maybe one of the ozeki can make it up or we see another rikishi who rise fast through the ranks (jsut remember how fast Asa and Hak rose).

We never know.

And by the way: neither was Wakanohana III a mediocre yokozuna nor was Harumafuji. Both were/are great skilled rikishi with a broad spectrum of techniques. Both deserved to be yokozunas. I guess it is just the fact that in the last decade(!) we get used to see two uber-dai-yokozunas...

[dingo 1,235]

While at the moment it may seem as if reaching 33 yusho would totally be in Hakuho's reach, I'd still be cautious to predict that. Reaching 33 means 8 more yushos which in turn means at the very least another 1,5 years winning every single basho. Even looking at Hakuho zensho-ing now, I still doubt it's going to be that smooth. There are at least three obstacles on his way there -- Harumafuji, age and health. Well, and add a fourth in new young contenders. Fighting and winning at the top level as he is now requires an immense amount of factors that you can directly influence (skill, power etc) as well as factors that you can't (health, quality of opponents). Considering those, I find it much less certain that Hakuho can beat the all-time record. It's by all means possible, but I don't think it's as set in stone as it may seem. Somehow I think that he either might come just 1-2 yushos short, or exceed the record by 1 or 2; in any case somewhere in that range. But I suppose only time will tell.

[Jakusotsu 5,894]

...and what's more: during the last six basho Hakuho seemed to be actively avoiding any firm grip on the mawashi. (I vaguely remember some kind of finger injury in Natsu 2012.) He has developed a new style, pushing at the upper body of the opponent, and so far it worked quite well. But how far will it take him?

(strange that this had never been mentioned around here, or is it only me hallucinating?)

[yorikiried by fate 2,010]

...and what's more: during the last six basho Hakuho seemed to be actively avoiding any firm grip on the mawashi. (I vaguely remember some kind of finger injury in Natsu 2012.) He has developed a new style, pushing at the upper body of the opponent, and so far it worked quite well. But how far will it take him?

(strange that this had never been mentioned around here, or is it only me hallucinating?)

The finger issue was some sort of smokescreen or other. First they declared it's the one hand, then Hakuho forgot and threw Gagamaru around with said hand, then he turned up with the tapes on the other and so on.

I also remember that Hakuho didn't touch a belt for the first eight or so bouts a couple of basho ago. (Still winning everything, of course.) Maybe it's a form of meditation for him to deny his strengths and search for the deepness of his weaknesses in order to further embrace the flow and whatnot.

Anyway, my impression this basho was that Hakuho has now even surpassed the level at which he made his 63.

Edited May 27, 2013 by yorikiried by fate

[Doitsuyama 1,178]

While at the moment it may seem as if reaching 33 yusho would totally be in Hakuho's reach, I'd still be cautious to predict that. Reaching 33 means 8 more yushos which in turn means at the very least another 1,5 years winning every single basho. Even looking at Hakuho zensho-ing now, I still doubt it's going to be that smooth. There are at least three obstacles on his way there -- Harumafuji, age and health. Well, and add a fourth in new young contenders. Fighting and winning at the top level as he is now requires an immense amount of factors that you can directly influence (skill, power etc) as well as factors that you can't (health, quality of opponents). Considering those, I find it much less certain that Hakuho can beat the all-time record. It's by all means possible, but I don't think it's as set in stone as it may seem. Somehow I think that he either might come just 1-2 yushos short, or exceed the record by 1 or 2; in any case somewhere in that range. But I suppose only time will tell.

Of course you are right in the sense that you never can be cautious enough. Yet, in the last 37 basho he had 24 yusho, and I think he still is far stronger than the rest, making him a clear favourite for the yusho in the short future. You never know how long this will last, but at his rate he'll need 12 basho for 8 yusho, and with hopefully more than two years left of a yusho-capable Hakuho it isn't too far fetched to bet on him to get the all-time record. I certainly would take the over in a bet.

[Asashosakari 19,112]

...and what's more: during the last six basho Hakuho seemed to be actively avoiding any firm grip on the mawashi. (I vaguely remember some kind of finger injury in Natsu 2012.) He has developed a new style, pushing at the upper body of the opponent, and so far it worked quite well. But how far will it take him?

(strange that this had never been mentioned around here, or is it only me hallucinating?)

The finger issue was some sort of smokescreen or other. First they declared it's the one hand, then Hakuho forgot and threw Gagamaru around with said hand, then he turned up with the tapes on the other and so on.

Well, I still think it might be a recurring elbow issue, not one with his fingers. There were periodic news of him having trouble with his elbow(s) between tournaments about two years ago, and he's certainly no longer the consistent yotsu machine he was in his first few years as yokozuna.

Actually, it would be surprising if he didn't have some sort of chronic problem after 8 years at the top level...

Of course you are right in the sense that you never can be cautious enough. Yet, in the last 37 basho he had 24 yusho, and I think he still is far stronger than the rest, making him a clear favourite for the yusho in the short future. You never know how long this will last, but at his rate he'll need 12 basho for 8 yusho, and with hopefully more than two years left of a yusho-capable Hakuho it isn't too far fetched to bet on him to get the all-time record. I certainly would take the over in a bet.

Things can go south quickly though. Kitanoumi averaged 13.1 wins for a 10-basho stretch from 1983.01 to 1984.07 (with 5 yusho) at age 27/28, then had only two more records above 11-4 in the next three and a half years and failed to complete the majority of the tournaments.

I have to say I'd be surprised if Hakuho will still be just as good as now on his 30th birthday (and I'd be shocked if he is still an active rikishi on his 32nd), so his shot at the yusho record might depend less on him than on everybody else - if Harumafuji falls apart just as quickly and nobody else steps up, Hakuho could still hoover up yusho while fighting at lower quality and winning only 13 bouts or even just 12. If the level around him is high enough that it's going to take 14-1's and 15-0's, his job will be much harder.

Edited May 27, 2013 by Asashosakari

[Akinomaki 40,231]

Sponichi reports that Hakuho was rejuvenated by changing his eating habits (a chanko reform). He got nutrition advice since last year's February.

Last Nagoya-basho the effects began to show. Reducing fat and meat, more (soy) bean products and vegetables. For the muscles to have energy, saccharides are best, so instead of meat and fat, cereals and beans. Rikishi often have insufficient mineral intake, especially magnesium, sulfur and zinc. Hakuho takes suppliments for that.

Result: The brain is revitalized and he can instantly judge situations.

Physically his body can longer do sumo - seems that means both longer bouts and doing it for more years. Sponichi finishes: The advisor thus give the stamp of approval to a long term yokozuna reign.

Edited May 27, 2013 by Akinomaki

[wanderer 159]

Injury, chronic or possible, is the only thing standing in his way to 33.

Hakuho has total control over everything else. Nutrition, power, technique, training, rest, skills, family, friends, and mental state.

He is the enlightened one.

[Akinomaki 40,231]

(former) Asashoryu comments: congratulations to the yusho. Including the time as sole yokozuna, and now that my junior buddy (otouto-bun) Harumafuji has become yokozuna, I think that as two yokozuna you fair and square have led the sumo world. But while at last having caught up with the number of yusho, it's a 100 years early for you to think you have caught up with the great me (idai naru watashi).

[yorikiried by fate 2,010]

(former) Asashoryu comments: congratulations to the yusho. Including the time as sole yokozuna, and now that my junior buddy (otouto-bun) Harumafuji has become yokozuna, I think that as two yokozuna you fair and square have led the sumo world. But while at last having caught up with the number of yusho, it's a 100 years early for you to think you have caught up with the great me (idai naru watashi).

Yeah! Show the boring bed sheet!

[dingo 1,235]

Of course you are right in the sense that you never can be cautious enough. Yet, in the last 37 basho he had 24 yusho, and I think he still is far stronger than the rest, making him a clear favourite for the yusho in the short future. You never know how long this will last, but at his rate he'll need 12 basho for 8 yusho, and with hopefully more than two years left of a yusho-capable Hakuho it isn't too far fetched to bet on him to get the all-time record. I certainly would take the over in a bet.

Things can go south quickly though. Kitanoumi averaged 13.1 wins for a 10-basho stretch from 1983.01 to 1984.07 (with 5 yusho) at age 27/28, then had only two more records above 11-4 in the next three and a half years and failed to complete the majority of the tournaments.

I have to say I'd be surprised if Hakuho will still be just as good as now on his 30th birthday (and I'd be shocked if he is still an active rikishi on his 32nd), so his shot at the yusho record might depend less on him than on everybody else - if Harumafuji falls apart just as quickly and nobody else steps up, Hakuho could still hoover up yusho while fighting at lower quality and winning only 13 bouts or even just 12. If the level around him is high enough that it's going to take 14-1's and 15-0's, his job will be much harder.

This is what I also meant to imply in my post -- in sumo you never know when your fortune could change. At Hakuho's level of competition it may only take a small thing to completely turn things around.

[Masumasumasu 902]

So boring. Im done with sumo.

Only a person's mind can be 'boring'.

[Swami 245]

...and what's more: during the last six basho Hakuho seemed to be actively avoiding any firm grip on the mawashi. (I vaguely remember some kind of finger injury in Natsu 2012.) He has developed a new style, pushing at the upper body of the opponent, and so far it worked quite well. But how far will it take him?

(strange that this had never been mentioned around here, or is it only me hallucinating?)

The finger issue was some sort of smokescreen or other. First they declared it's the one hand, then Hakuho forgot and threw Gagamaru around with said hand, then he turned up with the tapes on the other and so on.

Well, I still think it might be a recurring elbow issue, not one with his fingers. There were periodic news of him having trouble with his elbow(s) between tournaments about two years ago, and he's certainly no longer the consistent yotsu machine he was in his first few years as yokozuna.

Actually, it would be surprising if he didn't have some sort of chronic problem after 8 years at the top level...

Of course you are right in the sense that you never can be cautious enough. Yet, in the last 37 basho he had 24 yusho, and I think he still is far stronger than the rest, making him a clear favourite for the yusho in the short future. You never know how long this will last, but at his rate he'll need 12 basho for 8 yusho, and with hopefully more than two years left of a yusho-capable Hakuho it isn't too far fetched to bet on him to get the all-time record. I certainly would take the over in a bet.

Things can go south quickly though. Kitanoumi averaged 13.1 wins for a 10-basho stretch from 1983.01 to 1984.07 (with 5 yusho) at age 27/28, then had only two more records above 11-4 in the next three and a half years and failed to complete the majority of the tournaments.

I have to say I'd be surprised if Hakuho will still be just as good as now on his 30th birthday (and I'd be shocked if he is still an active rikishi on his 32nd), so his shot at the yusho record might depend less on him than on everybody else - if Harumafuji falls apart just as quickly and nobody else steps up, Hakuho could still hoover up yusho while fighting at lower quality and winning only 13 bouts or even just 12. If the level around him is high enough that it's going to take 14-1's and 15-0's, his job will be much harder.

Are you sure about those figures for Kitanoumi between 1983.01 & 1984.07? He only won one yusho (1984 Natsu) and only completed 3 entire basho in that time.

Swami

[Asameshimae 220]

(former) Asashoryu comments: congratulations to the yusho. Including the time as sole yokozuna, and now that my junior buddy (otouto-bun) Harumafuji has become yokozuna, I think that as two yokozuna you fair and square have led the sumo world. But while at last having caught up with the number of yusho, it's a 100 years early for you to think you have caught up with the great me (idai naru watashi).

Can I see the link for that - assuming you saw it online? Very interesting. Just makes me miss Asa and what he brought to the sport, good and bad.