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Kintamayama

Le Carnage al Orange de Chaingangage

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And now back-to-back days with all surviving six players picking the same ozeki. I wonder when that's going to backfire eventually.

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How about tomorrow?

Done. Four picked Baruto, the other two went out with Kotooshu. Congrats to tainosen!

Ganzohnesushi

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This isn't your usual Chaingang carnage - it's just the reverse.

By my count, 120 players started, and only 16 lost on day 1 (that includes 3 auto-picks). The other 104 go on to day 2.

Of the 120, 30 picked Iwakiyama, 19 Baruto and 11 Kotomitsuki (all won) so that's half the players right there. The most picked losing rikishi was Yamamotoyama (6). 23 different rikishi were chosen.

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Once again I'm out way too soon. I could easily have gone for Kotooshu, Harumafuji, Baruto, Iwakiyama or even Tokitenku (after all I had 14 of the last 16 bouts of the day right), but no, I though Bushuyama was safe enough. (In jonokuchi...)

Actually, it would make this game more interesting if you would score more the lower you aim. That you have to win to keep in, like the game already is, but that if you go for an Ozeki you only score 10 points, for Sekiwake 11 points, Komusubi 12 points, M1-4 already 13 points, M5-8 even 14 points, ... until J12-14 worth 20 points. This way, going for an Ozeki all basho long would only result in a maximum possible score of 150 points, which can also already be achieved by getting a J10 rikishi right for 8 days.

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Actually, it would make this game more interesting if you would score more the lower you aim. That you have to win to keep in, like the game already is, but that if you go for an Ozeki you only score 10 points, for Sekiwake 11 points, Komusubi 12 points, M1-4 already 13 points, M5-8 even 14 points, ... until J12-14 worth 20 points. This way, going for an Ozeki all basho long would only result in a maximum possible score of 150 points, which can also already be achieved by getting a J10 rikishi right for 8 days.

It's already done that way. Final order among all players losing on the same day is the average rank of the selected rikishi.

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Once again I'm out way too soon. I could easily have gone for Kotooshu, Harumafuji, Baruto, Iwakiyama or even Tokitenku (after all I had 14 of the last 16 bouts of the day right), but no, I though Bushuyama was safe enough. (In jonokuchi...)

Actually, it would make this game more interesting if you would score more the lower you aim. That you have to win to keep in, like the game already is, but that if you go for an Ozeki you only score 10 points, for Sekiwake 11 points, Komusubi 12 points, M1-4 already 13 points, M5-8 even 14 points, ... until J12-14 worth 20 points. This way, going for an Ozeki all basho long would only result in a maximum possible score of 150 points, which can also already be achieved by getting a J10 rikishi right for 8 days.

The whole point of the game is that you're out if your pick loses, so I don't see the relevance of the point system. In any case, there is a pseudo-point system, which is the tie-breaker. The lower you choose correctly, the higher you are in the standings.

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Many traps ready to spring tomorrow. With some luck, we could really be back on topic (carnage).

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Actually, it would make this game more interesting if you would score more the lower you aim. That you have to win to keep in, like the game already is, but that if you go for an Ozeki you only score 10 points, for Sekiwake 11 points, Komusubi 12 points, M1-4 already 13 points, M5-8 even 14 points, ... until J12-14 worth 20 points. This way, going for an Ozeki all basho long would only result in a maximum possible score of 150 points, which can also already be achieved by getting a J10 rikishi right for 8 days.

It's already done that way. Final order among all players losing on the same day is the average rank of the selected rikishi.

Which isn't really the same. The point is that I can think there are people going for some strong Sanyaku rikishi all basho long. And that I would like to think of a way to disencourage this kind of 'strategy'. As for myself, I'm tempted too often to risk going for a lower ranked rikishi. And they let me down more often than if I would constantly pick an Ozeki or Ozeki-like Sanyaku rikishi.

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As Kinta said though, the idea is just to survive through all 15 days. When Asashoryu was going on his zensho tears the option to choose Yokozuna was taken away to avoid people just choosing the top guys. At the same time, if someone wants to survive, and win Chaingang, they have to take that risk every so often in case a tie-breaker comes up. At least that's how I've always seen the game.

That said, if the game was to have a special prize, I'd say it would be a great candidate for one of them.

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Actually, it would make this game more interesting if you would score more the lower you aim. That you have to win to keep in, like the game already is, but that if you go for an Ozeki you only score 10 points, for Sekiwake 11 points, Komusubi 12 points, M1-4 already 13 points, M5-8 even 14 points, ... until J12-14 worth 20 points. This way, going for an Ozeki all basho long would only result in a maximum possible score of 150 points, which can also already be achieved by getting a J10 rikishi right for 8 days.

It's already done that way. Final order among all players losing on the same day is the average rank of the selected rikishi.

Which isn't really the same. The point is that I can think there are people going for some strong Sanyaku rikishi all basho long. And that I would like to think of a way to disencourage this kind of 'strategy'. As for myself, I'm tempted too often to risk going for a lower ranked rikishi. And they let me down more often than if I would constantly pick an Ozeki or Ozeki-like Sanyaku rikishi.

So you really would give the chaingang yusho to someone dropping out on day 8 over someone surviving until day 10 based on points. Sorry, but that would be a totally different game.

The way it is, Chaingang is the most Darwinian game among the sumo games universe. (Clapping wildly...)

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Many traps ready to spring tomorrow. With some luck, we could really be back on topic (carnage).

Aaaand... KER-SNAP!

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Many traps ready to spring tomorrow. With some luck, we could really be back on topic (carnage).

Aaaand... KER-SNAP!

Well... carnage is something totally else than what happened today. Still not on topic. Now if Harumafuji or Kotooshu would have lost...

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Well... carnage is something totally else than what happened today. Still not on topic. Now if Harumafuji or Kotooshu would have lost...

After all, it is possible to have carnage-less Chain-Gang basho, with all days seeing departure of reasonably small part of survivors.

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Many traps ready to spring tomorrow. With some luck, we could really be back on topic (carnage).

Aaaand... KER-SNAP!

Well... carnage is something totally else than what happened today. Still not on topic. Now if Harumafuji or Kotooshu would have lost...

Hey, I know the day was relatively free of upsets. Scores soared in all dailies. The snap was for my own untimely demise at the hands of a Juryo guy.

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As Kinta said though, the idea is just to survive through all 15 days. When Asashoryu was going on his zensho tears the option to choose Yokozuna was taken away to avoid people just choosing the top guys. At the same time, if someone wants to survive, and win Chaingang, they have to take that risk every so often in case a tie-breaker comes up. At least that's how I've always seen the game.

That said, if the game was to have a special prize, I'd say it would be a great candidate for one of them.

Maybe what Vikanohara refers to, is the fact that some time ago, not only the option to choose Yokozuna was taken away, but also the option of choosing Ozeki was taken away, which was indeed a bit more challenging, and maybe more selective, avoiding huge one-day carnage when an Ozeki faced an unexpected loss, as player where choosing less similar picks.

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Maybe what Vikanohara refers to, is the fact that some time ago, not only the option to choose Yokozuna was taken away, but also the option of choosing Ozeki was taken away, which was indeed a bit more challenging, and maybe more selective, avoiding huge one-day carnage when an Ozeki faced an unexpected loss, as player where choosing less similar picks.

Nothing stops a player from making Chaingang as challenging as he wants. Don't pick ozeki, don't pick West side rikishi on odd-numbered days, whatever. And as Zeokage says, choosing many high-ranking rikishi is generally not a good strategy for winning the Chaingang competition because - with 100+ players - you're unlikely to outlast absolutely everybody, and you're guaranteed to lose the tie-breaker, so players who want to win the yusho have to consider that. Obviously the game adminship feel that having that trade-off available makes the game more interesting, or the option of selecting ozeki would not have been re-added.

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Obviously the game adminship feel that having that trade-off available makes the game more interesting, or the option of selecting ozeki would not have been re-added.

The Ozeki lately are not something you can count on quality-wise. hence their return to the pick possibilities.

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Obviously the game adminship feel that having that trade-off available makes the game more interesting, or the option of selecting ozeki would not have been re-added.

The Ozeki lately are not something you can count on quality-wise. hence their return to the pick possibilities.

Though they're pretty predictable this basho thus far; I'm 16-0 on their bouts in Toto and I suspect I'm far from the only one. That probably just means the huge and unexpected upset is soon to come...

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if the game was to have a special prize, I'd say it would be a great candidate for one of them.

Yes, maybe it would be better for a sansho prize than for the main goal in the game.

And as Zeokage says, choosing many high-ranking rikishi is generally not a good strategy for winning the Chaingang competition because - with 100+ players - you're unlikely to outlast absolutely everybody, and you're guaranteed to lose the tie-breaker, so players who want to win the yusho have to consider that.

Well, maybe that's my problem. I never think of reaching the end in this game. (Whatever above, it is funny...)

My appearances so far in ChainGang :

8x out on day 1 (of which 4x in a row in my first 4 attempts in 2007)

7x out on day 2

2x out on day 3

1x out on day 11 => back then (Kyushu 07) I went for Sakaizawa from day 5 until he lost on day 11

1x out on day 12 => that basho (Aki 07) I went for Baruto from day 3 until he lost on day 12

So the two basho in which I did well, were the ones in which I jumped a bandwagon after a while and stayed on it until it crashed. I remember back then I argued that it would be more interesting if you wouldn't be allowed to pick any rikishi more than once during a basho. I still feel this way. In the end, ChainGang just isn't my type of game, I guess. I'll keep competing at it, but only to have one more exciting bout on the opening day(s). (Applauding...)

Edited by Vikanohara

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Ah, I'm still dreaming of the "Hardcore"-Chaingaing-Mode with every rikishi only one time allowed to pick ...

... but as Asashosakari did already point out nothing stops a player to play the game the way he/she wants - as I'm (unsuccessfully) doing it. (^^;)

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Ah, I'm still dreaming of the "Hardcore"-Chaingaing-Mode with every rikishi only one time allowed to pick ...

That was the original idea. Then, it found itself realized in Seki Quad.. Now, how did that happen.. (Whatever above, it is funny...) (Applauding...)

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