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madorosumaru

Quotes from Day 15 - Hatsu 2008

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Asashoryu: (Spending twenty minutes in the bath contemplating his defeat) First, I want to thank all of you [media guys] for doing a good job. [The fifteen days] did not seem that long to me. I did all that I could. I have no regrets. I just did not have what it takes this time.

More Ryu: (Elaborating on his failure) That I was not able to assert myself fully from the yotsu position is an [obvious] indication of my weakness and deficiency.

Even more Ryu: (Concluding with an ominous Schwartzenegger turn) [i'll be baack!] I am definitely planning on winning next basho.

Takasago Oyakata: (Saying what a shisho should) That was too bad. He did quite well for having trained for only about a month. I would like for him to further improve himself in his personal life and approach Haru Basho with the determination to win the championship.

Hakuho: (Putting it all in a nutshell) I have been working diligently since the last Summer Jungyo. I wasn't about to lose to a yokozuna who has been out of action all this time.

Kumagatani Oyakata: (Seeing this as a breakthrough event) This yusho has a totally different significance from the ones in the past. There will be a difficult road ahead but Hakuho should be up to the task. It is my hope that he will get into the mindset of leading the sumo world.

Jigjid Munkhbat, Hakuho's dad: (Commenting from back home in Ulaanbaatar) I won three straight Naadam 45 years ago. Now, my son has equalled that feat. I think the fans in both Mongolia and Japan are happy for him.

Sayoko-san, aka Mrs. Hakuho: (Nurturing, loyal, sensitive and smart) I was on pins and needles [watching the bout]. I massaged [my husband's painful] back everyday. He diligently studied tapes of himself and Asashoryu [all basho long]. He seemed more than ever to be conscious [of the rivalry]. [At home] I never brought up the subject of Asashoryu.

Mr. Nagata, non-fiction writer and a fan: (Expressing a highfalutin view) The yusho-decider was the ultimate confrontation. You could call it a battle between "Good" and "Evil." I believe there are many who feel relieved that the white-hatted hero, Hakuho, won. This tournament drew large crowds, but it was for both good reasons and bad, such as curiosity to see the return of the suspended Asashoryu. As for such matters as the death of the Tokitsukaze deshi, the Kyokai is doing a study of heya procedures, but frankly there doesn't appear to be any concrete plans for reform. They need to take advantage of the improved popularity to create an unsullied and less arcane world of sumo.

Kitanoumi Rijicho: (Viewing the proceedings from his spot atop Mt. Ozumo) Hakuho grabbed the uwate and got into an advantageous position. He was settled and comfortable because he could keep Asashoryu at bay. With the secure mawashi hold, he did not need to rush into an attack, such as with a throw. He couldn't ask for a better situation and he had plenty of wiggle room. Both yokozuna deserve a lot of credit for bringing [the basho] to such a climactic yusho-determining end after all the expectations. [As for the seven days of "SRO," I think there was considerable interest in how Asashoryu would perform.

Mr. Ebisawa: (Pontificating as chair of YDC) That was great. It was wonderful sumo. Either one of the rikishi could have won. I think it was a bout that will go down in history. There definitely hasn't been anything like this in recent years. It brought tears to my eyes. The two of them gambarized as a yokozuna tandem. It is my wish that they would enliven sumo even more. Although Asashoryu was 13-and-2, it appeared to me that he is fully recovered. I would give him 90 points. The remaining ten points have to do with hinkaku. There is still a way to go in the "soul" part of shin-gi-tai, but I believe that he will listen to others and endeavor to improve. Again, it is my fervent hope for the two yokozuna to bring sumo to a greater flourish.

More Takasago: (Discussing Ryu's possible return to Mongolia) All he needs to do is make a formal request. If there is nothing going on here, I don't think there is any reason why he shouldn't be able to go.

Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

Even more Takasago: (Hardly able to hide his glee) but I haven't heard any details. he he he he he

Daver Batobayal, formerly Kyokushuzan: (Visiting both yokozuna in the dressing prior to bout) Asashoryu said that I got fat, so I countered, "What about you?" I told Hakuho, who is almost like a brother, to do "his own sumo." Sure enough, he won.

Takamisakari: (Overstating matters as usual after finally achieving kachi-koshi on the last day) The difference between winning and losing is like that of heaven and hell. I only thought of attack, attack, attack. The rest of the sumo, I don't remember at all.

Goeido: (Experiencing the sharp blades of the meat-grinder for the first time) The guys in the upper ranks all have a lot of speed. If I don't learn to keep up with that, I won't be able to win.

Kotoshogiku: (Winning nine despite injury and kyujo) I am really pleased. Ironically, I was less tense after I returned from kyujo. Once I achieved kachi-koshi, winning became the best medicine of all.

Kotooshu: (Defeating Kaio to cap his escape from dreaded kadoban) I messed up the tachi-ai, but I kept my composure. I intend to do a lot of keiko to prepare for next basho.

Kaio: (Losing three straight to end up 8-7) That was a pretty sad way to finish up, but I still have the spirit to keep on going. Whenever I lose, I still get plenty upset.

Kotomitsuki: (Barely managing to avoid kadoban with a last day victory) I got really nervous thinking of all my losses.

Kisenosato: (Co-winner of Outstanding Performance Award) It is an honor. I felt good from the first day [when I beat Chiyotaikai].

Ama: (Co-winner of Outstanding Performance Award) I am happy even though I am not out there to win awards. I didn't think I could defeat Hakuho three straight times.

Takekaze: (Winner of Fighting Spirit Award) I was fighting for my life everyday. There is a tendency to get full of oneself and let up when one succeeds like this, so I am going to try to keep a proper focus.

Kakuryu: (Winner of Technical Award) I was able to stay calm throughout and do good sumo. This basho was another great experience. I'll try not to get spoiled by success and train hard towards next basho.

Quote of the Day

An anonymous oyakata: If they allowed Asashoryu to get yusho, all the makuuchi rikishi should shave their heads. That would be simply pathetic!

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Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

Is Uchidate injured? If not, she should be suspended...two basho should be about right. (I'm not kidding).

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Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

Is Uchidate injured? If not, she should be suspended...two basho should be about right. (I'm not kidding).

Only if she plays ten minutes of a soccer game for charity, which I doubt very much ....

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Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

Is Uchidate injured? If not, she should be suspended...two basho should be about right. (I'm not kidding).

Well, unlike Asashoryu she did submit the proper paperwork.

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Only if she plays ten minutes of a soccer game for charity, which I doubt very much ....

...and then acts like a spoilt teen hiding in her room before running away to Mongolia etc etc....

uhm, incorrect: that should happen AFTERWARDS .... By the way: we are all joking, I presume ...

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Daver Batobayal, formerly Kyokushuzan: (Visiting both yokozuna in the dressing prior to bout) Asashoryu said that I got fat, so I countered, "What about you?" I told Hakuho, who is almost like a brother, to do "his own sumo." Sure enough, he won.

Wehehehehe (Jumping in ecstasy...)

Me too....diet from tomorrow...in examination time I gained about 3 kilos... (Showing respect...)

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Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

With all due to respect to the Ms., this is totally childish, unprofessional and uncalled for. With this, all she proves is that she is vindictive and petty. Regardless of her great understanding of Sumo and everything she is doing for college sumo etc.. etc.., this is way out of line. She has a job to do, and presumably she was chosen because someone thought she could do it. She obviously can't.

She should resign from the YDC and fight the fight for whatever it is she wants from the sidelines. This is totally personal, and has no place in the YDC.

To me , she has resigned from the YDC.

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To me , she has resigned from the YDC.

Does this mean you will pretend not to see any photos of her for future daily photo threads?

It means I will not mention her name anymore, and every time someone else mentions her name I will bang the table with my shoe and mumble words of discontent. I will omit her from every translation I do, and I will wish her sumo-bu college team to lose badly.

I will never watch any Star Wars movie again.

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Only if she plays ten minutes of a soccer game for charity, which I doubt very much ....

...and then acts like a spoilt teen hiding in her room before running away to Mongolia etc etc....

She has acted like a spoilt teen all along, hasn't she.

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Miss Uchidate, member of YDC and not a Ryu fan: (Asking to be excused from the post-basho YDC meeting) I think I would just be in the way. I don't want to be a bother to the Kyokai.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martinet

"In an extended sense, a martinet is a person for whom rules and etiquette are paramount: martinets often use etiquette and other rules as an excuse to trump ethics, to the point that etiquette loses its ethical ground. "

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sokuho076_1.jpg

In a last-minute change of mind, Miss Uchidate did show up for the YDC meeting. "Even though I had not been interviewed, some statements attributed to me have been published in the newspapers," she explained as the reason for her presence.

However, she had no comment for the gathered media: "If I say anything, it would only lead to misunderstanding. I will put everything in writing." With that, she hurriedly left the Kokugikan.

According to Mr. Ebisawa, chairman of the committee, "She did not have anything provocative to say at the meeting."

To be continued . . .

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First of all, Madorosumaru,

Thank you for these interesting comments. It's nice to know what the various people involved in sumo think.

Now----Mr Nagata has a right to call it good Vs. Evil.

I take part in a sumo game which lists who players picked to win a certain bout.

Well Mr Nagata, you would be surprised how many people picked evil, including myself. Maybe you are the evil one. Even though my pick lost I was proud of how he did this basho. I have never considered him to be evil. His sumo talent is unbelievelable.

Now for my favorite part of this reply.

Miss Uchidate, I can't thank you enough for getting out of the YDC's way and getting out the sumo fans way including me, by keeping your venemous mouth SHUT.

I feel much better after venting here.

philafuji

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philafuji- You may have discerned from my personal profile and past posts that I am an Asashoryu fan of longstanding. One can easily see who gets the top billing in the "Quotes" threads. (Neener, neener...) However, I am cognizant of the reality that, in Japan, which after all is the home of Ozumo, Ryu is considered "The Heel" --in fact, that is the term they use. The vast majority of Japanese fans wanted Hakuho to win. Even those that picked Ryu to win did so grudgingly because they do respect his ability on the dohyo. I've stuck with Ryu through thick and thin although I recognize his foibles and how he must irk someone who is less tolerant of such behavior. I think I like him all the more because he has to battle his personal demons. What the hey, even that ultimate warrior, Achilles, had his "heel." Sorry, couldn't help that.

As for Miss Uchidate, we have not heard the last of her on this matter. As I wrote earlier, the soap opera is "to be continued . . ."

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As for Miss Uchidate, we have not heard the last of her on this matter. As I wrote earlier, the soap opera is "to be continued . . ."

Somewhat tipsy?

f-sp-080128-3301-ns.jpg

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.... Now----Mr Nagata has a right to call it good Vs. Evil.

I am happy to see that somebody else considers this sentence as awful as it really is. Months ago, at the beginning of the Asashoryu saga I wrote something like: let us hope that this does not become one of those idiot wrestling story: "the Good White Yokozuna is here to save Japan from the Naughty Dark Mongolian Yokozuna". I am afraid it can still happen. Hakuho is a Mongolian too, but nobody is perfect...

I Miss Uchidate, I can't thank you enough for getting out of the YDC's way and getting out the sumo fans way including me, by keeping your venemous mouth SHUT.

philafuji

Come on , philafuji, what world would this be without Ms. Uchidate ? First of all, she says what she thinks more than many of her male colleagues do, and I am told this is not a "normal" attitude in Japan; and I like this aspect of her at least. Second, she keeps giving us matters and topics to discuss about one of the greatests sumo champions ! Long live Ms. Uchidate then !

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I am happy to see that somebody else considers this sentence as awful as it really is. Months ago, at the beginning of the Asashoryu saga I wrote something like: let us hope that this does not become one of those idiot wrestling story: "the Good White Yokozuna is here to save Japan from the Naughty Dark Mongolian Yokozuna". I am afraid it can still happen. Hakuho is a Mongolian too, but nobody is perfect...o champions ! Long live Ms. Uchidate then !

Why not? I'm usually not somebody to subscribe to the "any publicity is good publicity" theory, but I don't see any problem if the press (or even Makiko Uchidate) wants to frame Asashoryu/Hakuho as a good vs. evil thing. As long as it doesn't spill over to what happens on the dohyo, I really don't see how it matters.

Besides, plenty of Asashoryu fans have delighted in playing the "misunderstood outsider Asashoryu vs. the stodgy Kyokai idiots" card for years now; it's hardly surprising that there's some pushback now. The time to stop this from becoming an "idiot pro wrestling story" was 2004...what we're getting now is merely the logical continuation of what's been brewing for a long, long time.

Now----Mr Nagata has a right to call it good Vs. Evil.

I take part in a sumo game which lists who players picked to win a certain bout.

Well Mr Nagata, you would be surprised how many people picked evil, including myself.

Well, here's a game player who picked Asashoryu even though I like Hakuho better, and I doubt I was the only one. Sumo games aren't a popularity contest.

Edited by Asashosakari

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Mitsuru Yaku, cartoonist and sumo cognoscenti: Both rikishi thrilled us thoroughly with inspired, thinking sumo. Asashoryu may have thought of himself as the Numero Uno, but the title has changed hands. It would be interesting to see how he will come back to regain his crown. Asashoryu seems to have fallen snugly into the role of the "heel," but I feel a rikishi should be an object of respect and adoration and that a confrontational set-up of "Hero" vs. "Villain" is unbefitting of sumo. Asashoryu should not simply accept his role as a heel and endeavor to re-make himself to become the kind of yokozuna that would be respected by all.

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Mitsuru Yaku, cartoonist and sumo cognoscenti: Both rikishi thrilled us thoroughly with inspired, thinking sumo. Asashoryu may have thought of himself as the Numero Uno, but the title has changed hands. It would be interesting to see how he will come back to regain his crown. Asashoryu seems to have fallen snugly into the role of the "heel," but I feel a rikishi should be an object of respect and adoration and that a confrontational set-up of "Hero" vs. "Villain" is unbefitting of sumo. Asashoryu should not simply accept his role as a heel and endeavor to re-make himself to become the kind of yokozuna that would be respected by all.

I agree with Yaku-san in spirit. Unfortunately, I feel that Asashoryu enthusiastically sought and embraced this role many moons ago. I think it would have been more accurate to say that, now that Asashoryu is no longer the only protagonist, he should shed his role as a heel and endeavor to re-make himself to become the kind of yokozuna that would be respected by all.

There was a time several years ago when I thought he was actually doing that and I defended him, but I was wrong. That was when life was a bed of roses and all the dragons were dead. Now, as long as Hakuho keeps his nose clean and can at least match Ryu yusho for yusho, I believe Ryu is stuck with this role. He won't/can't be Mr. Nice Guy unless he's king of the hill.

I'll add the usual, "I hope I'm wrong about this." knowing there are some who won't believe it...

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As for Miss Uchidate, we have not heard the last of her on this matter. As I wrote earlier, the soap opera is "to be continued . . ."

Somewhat tipsy?

f-sp-080128-3301-ns.jpg

Oh, come on. Let's lay off Ms. Uchidate. I thought she did a great job as Yubaba in Spirited Away (千と千尋の神隠し). (Sign of disapproval...)

post-1801-1201588032.jpeg

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I agree with Yaku-san in spirit. Unfortunately, I feel that Asashoryu enthusiastically sought and embraced this role many moons ago. I think it would have been more accurate to say that, now that Asashoryu is no longer the only protagonist, he should shed his role as a heel and endeavor to re-make himself to become the kind of yokozuna that would be respected by all.

I think there's more to it, and at the risk of permanently ruining my sumo credibility, I'll draw out the pro-wrestling comparison even further. At its most basic level, the whole Asashoryu/Kyokai thing going all the way back to 2003 has been a (toned down, admittedly) real-life version of the Steve Austin "defiant anti-hero champion vs. the powers that be" storyline WWF/E ran so successfully. And at the very least among many non-Japanese fans, that clearly struck a chord. (Although rarely for reasons other than kneejerk distrust of authority in general, I dare say...)

The problem right now is, a) the suspension pretty clearly re-asserted who's the boss here, even if they took several years too long to take that stand, and b) the "Corporate Champion" (Hakuho) is actually viewed as the babyface by the majority of Japanese sumo fans, when that's the role that is "supposed to be" Asashoryu's, certainly in the eyes of the aforementioned non-Japanese fans - whose opinion, for better or worse, doesn't matter a whole lot to how the Kyokai or the Japanese view sumo. (Some pro-Shoryu people on the SML were a bit touchy on that point last year; apparently they didn't like to have it pointed out that their [and my] opinions may not actually be considered important by the people who matter.)

Anyway, it's hard to be the anti-hero rebel when most people don't care to see any rebelling going on, and that's where Asashoryu is stuck now, post-suspension. It's certainly possible that he'll embrace the heel role fully now, but I think he's too smart for that. Being defiant is one thing when it's considered kinda cool and you're the only game in town anyway; acting provocative when nobody cares for it and they have another top dog to cheer for is just going to come across as pathetic, in an over-the-hill has-been sort of way. And unlike some forum members, I don't think it's the case that Asashoryu just can't help being the way he is...he'll probably never been a model yokozuna, whatever the heck that is, but I certainly expect him to be capable of toning things down sufficiently that he'll come across merely as (ugh, buzzword alert) edgy rather than off-putting. He more or less did it once before, back in 2005 - now he needs to find enough mental stability to do it again when he's not winning every single yusho available and riding an emotional high all the time.

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In a word we could say that in any organization a certain (not too big) degree of rebellion can happen to be accepted or tolerated if you are the first, but never if you are the second... Asashoryu was the first, then he was marked as the second for two basho only because of the suspension, now after this basho he is the second also OFFICIALLY. He will have to stay intelligently quiet at least till next basho, where he has to show that he is back completely. Not even if he wins next basho, however, will he be the ONLY ONE, so the age of his "rebellion" is over ! (I call it "rebellion" even if I personally tend to consider many of his "sins" only a sign that he is a human being and not a marionette ...)

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Asashoryu was the first, then he was marked as the second for two basho only because of the suspension

Completely disagree as I did when I read the same thing in sumo world. Just look at Hakuho's reaction to having Asashoryu back. If he had been there in Aki and Kyushu I think Hakuho would have still won but with better records.

Sorry, I was not clear: I will try to explain my concept better.

In Aki Asashoryu was Yokozuna East = official number one.

In Kyushu Asashoryu was Yokozuna West = official number two, just because he was not there in Aki: even if Hakuho had had a bad performance in Aki basho, Hakuho would have been Yokozuna East in Kyushu.

Exactly the same applies to Hatsu basho in relation with Kyushu basho.

So in both Kyushu and Hatsu the relative position of the two Yokozuna was directly caused by an external factor (Asashoryu not taking part to previous basho).

NOW for the first time Hakuho is first and Asashoryu is second directly because of their performance in a basho, so this is the first time that their standings are not debatable with ifs and buts.

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Well if Ozumo needs a bad boy for marketing reasons so be it. I for my part consider this rather silly, as much of the Asashoryu soap opera.

More generally, Hakuho will have his partisan fans going forward and Asashoryu will have his. And then there will be the many folks -- myself included -- who simply want to see good, fast, intense, technical, gripping sumo. And for this, the emerging rivalry of two roughly equally matched Yokozuna is a gift from heaven. Ozumo hasn't had this since the days of Takanohana and Akebono.

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why do i care so little for all this "Asashoryu is a bad boy" fuss? I only care for 2 healthy, competitive and powerful Yokozuna. I have what i wish so i am a happy Sumo fan. Simple as that.

the last day of this basho was exactly what we needed in order to remember how good it is to have 2 yokozuna fighting for the yusho untill senshuraku.

we should ourselves play down a bit the negative hype around Asa. We should concentrate more on the Sumo and less on the gossip. Let's talk about certain bouts that we found interesting for technical reasons for example. Let's talk about the style of the bouts between Asa and Hakuho compared to their bouts with other rikishi. Why do they fight so upright? why do they seem to float on the dohyo in perfect unison? Why do i get the feeling that i am watching a Wajima-Takanohana bout?

let's talk about that for a change...

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... the emerging rivalry of two roughly equally matched Yokozuna is a gift from heaven. Ozumo hasn't had this since the days of Takanohana and Akebono.

My fingers are crossed. (Whatever above, it is funny...)

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