Asa in hot water-thread 2

[Kaikitsune Makoto 210]

According to freshest of news, Asashoryu is allowed to go to MOngolia to have treatment.

[Peterao 3]

According to freshest of news, Asashoryu is allowed to go to MOngolia to have treatment.

Is this the article you refer to?

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/knews/news/2007/08/2...0820000016.html

The first time I read it I thought it was just a report that another doctor has recommended that Asashoryu be treated in Mongolia. It was reported over 4 hours ago, but Google News reports no other news stories since...I would think that if Asashoryu had "won", the reports would be flying much faster...

[Jonosuke 28]

If the Kyokai is prepared to approve his return to Mongolia, they are overruling his shisho as Takasago oyakata has said he would not let him return.

Perhaps the Kyokai had decided to go along with a medical decision.

Hope this will be the beginning of Asashoryu's road to recovery. But it would take much longer for him to regain his reputation back in Japan. Asashoryu's handlers should remember he would be observed much closer this time by Japanese media so he needs to be careful on what he says and does once he goes back.

Edited August 20, 2007 by Jonosuke

[Guest haroda]

the last news I heard about 2PM JST said that after he is treated in Japan he may be allowed to go to mongolia. It is all still a rumor from I can determine.

If he is allowed to break his punishment and return to mongolia he should stay there and be removed from Sumo.

[Peterao 3]

I think all that they are saying as that the Kyokai will allow him to return to Mongolia for treatment, without conifrming that he actually is going back.

Then again, the only online news reports I could find that mention this are NHK and the oyaji rag Gendai, so who knows?

[Kaikitsune Makoto 210]

Amanogawa was my source. She reported live from Japan in the morning when she watched NHK news on TV. According to her it was not in speculation-mode but stated as a fact that some doctor again had recommended returning to MOngolia AND that Kyokai had accepted that. That was the way NHK news had reported it and I would think NHK is the biblical truth of Japanese media? Like BBC or CNN or YLE!

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

It's in the Mainichi Daily News: http://mdn.mainichi-msn.co.jp/sports/news/...0sp024000c.html

And Kyodo News: http://home.kyodo.co.jp/modules/fstCategor...?cmenuid=6&

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj 0]

Next question is. -Will he return?

- HOW TO RETURN if he returns?

[Jonosuke 28]

Kyokai's chairman Kitanoumi oyakata indicated that he would likely go along with Kyokai's chief medical doctor's conclusion to have Asashoryu receiving his treatment in Mongolia.

"While we have in place the suspension as handed down by Directors, I believe it is prudent for us to listen to our medical team's recommendation and direction, and act accordingly, " Kitanoumi oyakata, Kyokai chairman, told reporters after hearing the latest diagnosis by Dr. Hiroyuki Yoshida, Kyokai's chairman of Medical Committee. Dr. Yoshida accompanied Kyokai's appointed psychiatrist Dr. Takagi who examined Asashoryu at his home today.

Asashoryu's condition is now changed to "Dissociative Identity Disorder" from "Actute Stress Disorder". "We are not talking about a life and death sitaution but he needs a medical treatment. Having him treated here with all the media surrounding him will not be an ideal condition for him. We feel Asashoryu will improve only under a condition he feels comfortable, " Dr. Yoshida said.

Asashoryu's current state is to be one of "bewilderment". Dr. Takagi explains it to be a state where even though a patient acknowledges an external stimulation he shows no will to respond. Dr. Yoshida indicated that during their examination on August 17 and 19, Asashoryu hardly responded to the physician while only staring at TV screen all the time. He has not uttered more than "ah.." or "oooh..".

"The current diagnosis is based on certain information supplied by those attending Asashoryu, Tsukebito and others, as well. Our psychiatrist believes it is best to respect the yokozuna's wish and have the future treatment conducted in an enivironment he feels the most comfortable. I am inclined to believe it is best for him to return to Mongolia," Dr. Yoshida said.

This was the first time the actual diagnosis was formally presented to Kitanoumi oyakata with a variety of options including recommended facilities and treatment methods.

Edited August 20, 2007 by Jonosuke

[Jonosuke 28]

It is reported today the Kyokai executives will be ready to approve Asashoryu's request to return to Mongolia. Their latest decision was made after the chairman of Kyokai's medical committee Dr. Hiroyuki Yoshida forwarded a diagnosis report by their appointed psychiartrist, Dr. Takagi, stating Asashoryu was suffering from Dissociative Identity Disorder and recommended Asashoryu should receive further treatment in Mongolia.

Since his suspension was announced, Asashoryu consistently indicated his desire to go back to Mongolia and upon the latest medical recommendation, the Kyokai agreed to permit his return reversing their earlier stand.

However the permission comes with rather harsh conditions:

1) He must stay in Japan during the Aki and Kyushu basho. He must resume his training as soon as he is able.

2) During his stay in Mongolia, if he is found to engage in any activity considered to be outside of treatment or rehabilitation, he will face a summary dismissal from his position and Kyokai.

There are still voices within the Kyokai that say they are dealing too lenient with Asashoryu as the Directors already came out with the two basho suspension as well as the yokokzuna to refrain from all regular activities other than treatment and training while staying home. Takasago oyataka also maintains the first priortiy is for Asashoryu to be treated in Japan before he returns to Mongolia. It is likely that the Kyokai's new approach must be discussed again at a special Directors meeting before Asashoryu is allowed to return to Mongolia.

Some believes this latest reversal by the Kyokai executives is based on other external factors such as a demonstration outside Japanese Embassy in Mongolia and calls being made from the Minister of Education and Science regarding their uncoordinated handling of the controversy as well as possible effects to the upcoming Aki basho. Likely this has come to a point where they can no logner afford to keep it as a simply shisho-deshi problem.

As for the conditions placed on Asashoryu, the first can be considered nothing unusual as all injured rikishi must stay in their heya or house to care for their injury however the second is rather extraordinary in its gravity. It plainly declares that should Asashoryu commit another irregularity, there will be no tomorrow, it will absolutely be final.

While reports circulate about Asashoryu's business interests in Mongolia, once back home, how Asashoryu will take this latest "sentence" and how he handles himself in this "no more Matta" predicament will be anyone's guess.

[Jonosuke 28]

More sound bits:

At the funeral of former yokozuna Kotozakura, Yokozuna Deliberarion Commitee chairman Katsuji Ebisawa commented that in his own personal view they should follow the specialist's recommendation and let Asashoryu be treated in his home country.

"As for the actual handling, I will let the Kyokai officials deal with it. I have not had a direct discussion with the Kyokai chairman on the matter so he is not aware of my personal opinion, " Ebisawa said.

When told of the YDC chairman's comment, Kitanoumi oyakata said, "I believe what he is saying is that they will let the Kyokai directors manage it (Asashoryu's return). However let me make it clear that I have not come out and stated personally that I have approved his return to Mongolia".

[slt 9]

At the funeral of former yokozuna Kotozakura, Yokozuna Deliberarion Commitee chairman Katsuji Ebisawa commented that in his own personal view they should follow the specialist's recommendation and let Asashoryu be treated in his home country.

I take it Asa didn't show up at the funeral ?

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj 0]

Some believes this latest reversal by the Kyokai executives is based on other external factors such as a demonstration outside Japanese Embassy in Mongolia and calls being made from the Minister of Education and Science regarding their uncoordinated handling of the controversy as well as possible effects to the upcoming Aki basho. Likely this has come to a point where they can no logner afford to keep it as a simply shisho-deshi problem.

2-3 members of Parlament met with demonstrators few days ago and requested them to calm down. After talk, demonstrators stopped the demonstration in front of Emobassy of Japan. City police returned their previously ceased vehicle documents and banners.

President of Mongolia N. Enkhbayar expressed his opinion for Asashoryu. Although he does not want to "involve" , he called NSC to understand "young man's condition" (On the banzuke...)

bad boy come back home

Edited August 21, 2007 by Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj

[Jonosuke 28]

It now appears that Kitanoumi oyakata has been hearing from Kyokai's hardliners regarding Kyokai's chief medical doctor's recommendaion to allow Asashoryu to return home.

"While we all respect the physician's recommendation, we cannot easily persuade others of its merit if we simply let him go back right away to Mongolia. I am asking our doctors to see if they cannot find alternate treatment here in Japan first," Kitanoumi oyakata said today.

Kitanoumi oyakata added he had a responsiblity to ensure they pursue all possible avenues of treatment within Japan before negating the Directors decision.

"I am wondering if his condition can change only if he steps out of his room and to go somewhere else. Isn't anyone who can convince the yokozuna to do just that? Can't we call his family members back here?"

Dr. Yoshida, Kyokai's chief doctor, agreed to take the oyakata's suggestion back to their psychiatrist to consult on the next course of action. "My feeling is that it would not be an easy task but I will certainly take it up with Dr. Takagi, our specialist," Dr. Yoshida said.

Despite this latest movement, Kyokai officials have indicated already if they could get a consensus from the Directors, Asashoryu could go back to Mongolia as early as the end of this week.

Edited August 21, 2007 by Jonosuke

[Peterao 3]

Why haven't we heard anything more from the Yokozuna Deliberation C (Council? Committee? Community? Conglameration?) about this? The one time they have a chance to wield some authority beyond rubber stamping a sure promotion, and not a peep!

Uchidate-san, Ebi-chan, we need the sage wisdom that only you can offer us! Please! (On the banzuke...)

UPDATE: Courtesy of Jonosuke on the SML:

At the funeral of former yokozuna Kotozakura, Yokozuna

Deliberarion Committee chairman Katsuji Ebisawa

commented that in his own personal view they should

follow the specialist's recommendation and let

Asashoryu be treated in his home country.

"As for the actual handling, I will let the Kyokai

officials deal with it. I have not had a direct

discussion with the Kyokai chairman on the matter so

he is not aware of my personal opinion, " Ebisawa

said.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Peterao

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

JSA won't allow Asashoryu to return to Mongolia

Wednesday, August 22, 2007 at 07:15 EDT

TOKYO

[tomayama 8]

Just for the curious:

Now even german newsmagazine "Der Spiegel" has an article about Asa's punishment online.

They sum up the mess quite nicely withhout mentioning the jungyo, but stating that he was suspended for faking an injury. Title is "Gro

[Kintamayama 47,337]

The Mongolian President: "The number one best thing for him should be recuperating in his birthplace Mongolia, I think... ".

In regard to the punishment itself: "In Japan, there are Japanese ways things are done. When in Rome, act like the Romans do. Still, maybe they can understand the feelings of young people as well.."

Personally, I think there is no way he will be allowed to return to Mongolia. Contrary to all that is being said and written in the papers, so far nobody of "importance" has come forth and indicated otherwise. On the contrary, Kitanoumi has plainly said he never said Asa will be allowed to return to Mongolia for treatment. At least, AFAIK..

[Kintamayama 47,337]

Why haven't we heard anything more from the Yokozuna Deliberation C (Council? Committee? Community? Conglameration?) about this? The one time they have a chance to wield some authority beyond rubber stamping a sure promotion, and not a peep!

Uchidate-san, Ebi-chan, we need the sage wisdom that only you can offer us! Please! (Laughing...)

Ebisawa was the one who said to Kitanoumi that all sumo fans are expecting a punishment they can agree with and was surely one of the first line bashers at the onset of this story. Now, he is shocked by how things progressed and is trying to "put the plug back in the socket". "He seems to be taking it very bad mentally..", he said. As for ex-Chairman Ishibashi: "We can't squash the Yokozuna!!". (I'll bet he was one of the more vocal voices calling for a tough sentence at first).

In short, voices from the YDC are now concerned over how and why this whole thing was/is being handled, and they are not afraid to publicly voice these concerns, or maybe they are trying to cover their asses in case something bad happens.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 47,337]

Kitanoumi is against a Mongolian recuperation. The new doctor Takagi is taking the rijicho head -on on this. He is all for it. Kitanoumi asked Dr. Yoshida to convey to the new doctor his wish that Asa start commuting to a local hospital daily. "The man does not want to do that.. It doesn't look like he's going to get better this way. Commuting to a hospital is impossible with the press going mad. That's why it's important he be allowed to return to Mongolia!", he said plainly, suggesting the urgency and necessity of a Mongolian re-treatment. Till then, he suggested daily treatment at home. But a "quick" Mongolian retreat is being negated by Takasago Oyakata as well. He still thinks the doctor should visit him and start treating him at home. Dr. Yoshida, together with Takasago Oyakata and Asa's manager, have signed a paper formally requesting Dr. Takagi continue treating Asa.

Tomorrow, the doctor will be visiting Asa at his house to examine him for the third time.The results of these examinations will be announced on the 24th by Dr. Yoshida.

[Kintamayama 47,337]

Asa has left his house. Takasago Oyakata said he left to receive treatment from the Kyokai's designated doctor, but there is no intention of going to a hospital today.

On the way to the airport?? Seems he is on his way to see the doctor, as more info trickles in.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Jonosuke 28]

Kitanoumi is against a Mongolian recuperation.

We really don't know this but I am with Asashosakari on this. Kitanoumi being a former yokozuna himself, knows more than anyone else what Asashoryu has to put up with. Remember while he was yokozuna, he has often been accused of his rather indifferent and gruff demeanor to others despite his superb records.

Kitanoumi has been always more subdued than other oyakata as far as criticism against Asashoryu. I think the reason he commented he has never stated he approved Asashoryu's return to Mongolia was he knew there were strong "anti-special treatment" factions within the Kyokai so he wanted to tell them there was nothing definite as major news outlets already reported that the Kyokai approved Asashoryu's return to Mongolia.

Kitanoumi oyakata just did not want to astray anyone as it was not a done deal yet. The "pro" group will still need to convince the other side as on this issue there appears to be no one sitting on the fence and the line has clearly split. Kintanoumi and others feel the current situation in the Kyokai to be clearly dangerous with so much vitriol flying back and forth even within the normal staid halls of the Kyokai.

However I have a feeling that the Kyokai will eventually let Asashoryu return to Mongolia sooner than later as more pressures are mounting against the "anti" faction.

Edit: I actually neglect to mention the most sensible reason Kitanoumi cannot be against a Mongolian recuperation. Just like all of us here, he has been hearing about those great hotsprings and spas in Mongolai. A rumor is just on the other day he has been overheard saying he wished he would the one to get to go for a recuperation in Mongolia.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Jonosuke

[Kintamayama 47,337]

Kitanoumi is against a Mongolian recuperation.

We really don't know this but I am with Asashosakari on this.

Oh, but we do! He has said it openly and in no ambiguous way:

http://hochi.yomiuri.co.jp/sports/sumo/new...-OHT1T00037.htm (just one example)

"I respect the diagnosis (that Asa would be best off getting treatment in Mongolia) but couldn't he get treatment in Japan? I haven't thought to let him return to Mongolia. Everyone has not agreed to that..", is more or less what he is saying.

What we don't know is if he REALLY thinks this is the way it should be, or, if, as you say, he's playing the favorable winds at present.

So, why now, suddenly, has Asa left the house to go for treatment?? Why NOW, a few hours after his attending physician said it is impossible??

Edited August 22, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Coo-cook 0]

Kitanoumi is against a Mongolian recuperation.

We really don't know this but I am with Asashosakari on this. Kitanoumi being a former yokozuna himself, knows more than anyone else what Asashoryu has to put up with. Remember while he was yokozuna, he has often been accused of his rather indifferent and gruff demeanor to others despite his superb records.

Kitanoumi has been always more subdued than other oyakata as far as criticism against Asashoryu. I think the reason he commented he has never stated he approved Asashoryu's return to Mongolia was he knew there were strong "anti-special treatment" factions within the Kyokai so he wanted to tell them there was nothing definite as major news outlets already reported that the Kyokai approved Asashoryu's return to Mongolia.

Kitanoumi oyakata just did not want to astray anyone as it was not a done deal yet. The "pro" group will still need to convince the other side as on this issue there appears to be no one sitting on the fence and the line has clearly split. Kintanoumi and others feel the current situation in the Kyokai to be clearly dangerous with so much vitriol flying back and forth even within the normal staid halls of the Kyokai.

However I have a feeling that the Kyokai will eventually let Asashoryu return to Mongolia sooner than later as more pressures are mounting against the "anti" faction.

Edit: I actually neglect to mention the most sensible reason Kitanoumi cannot be against a Mongolian recuperation. Just like all of us here, he has been hearing about those great hotsprings and spas in Mongolai. A rumor is just on the other day he has been overheard saying he wished he would the one to get to go for a recuperation in Mongolia.

I always thought Kitanoumi is a guy who always want to support his Yokozuna and try to find a way to pull him out of mud (it's not first time). I hope he will do it again (how?...is the question).

What Asa wants is more being far away from media and attention than longing for some hotspas or mom's kitchen, I think.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Coo-cook

[Kintamayama 47,337]

A woman named デビ夫人 (probably some big celeb) said at ex-Kotozakura's funeral : "I don't think he's sick!! He should cut it out!!" she said.

Akebono was there as well, and this is what he had to say: "A yokozuna is someone with very powerful emotional strength! He can't be weak like that! Anyhow, I hope he gets over it!", he said.